I have started getting into the habit now of asking people that proclaim to be anti something… why? With Starbucks, this is where my frustration starts. “The coffee is sh*t!” is by far and wide the number one response. This is crap. OK I can understand how someone who has 3 coffees per day from the top Ponsonby café’s can taste the difference. These are the coffee freaks that can pick their brand out of a blind taste test line up and even tell what kind of grass the cow that gave their milk for this coffee was eating! These people worship good coffee and generally they find themselves drinking coffee at café’s that are attached to the roasteries and have highly trained barrista’s.
AS FOR THE REST OF YOU… Come on! Starbucks is mostly better than your average. They use decent beans, they have technology in play to ensure good steaming of the milk, they even have vast training for the bubbly staff that are making the coffee. Starbucks is not some burnt-coffee-burnt-separated-oversteamed-sour milk establishment. They have not become the global powerhouse by serving a shitload of venti dishwaters!
If you are going to be anti Starbucks at least be honest say “Sure it’s good coffee, but it’s expensive and overpriced and not as fully ‘fair trade’ as they claim” as you sip your alternatively branded half the size but half the price cup of coffee in your $300 diesel sneakers and your $420 italian denim jeans!
I like the nice things as much as the rest of them but I just like what I like? I am honest about what I do and don’t like. I admit I like the Killers but I am also not afraid to admit that I liked Justin Timberlake as an artist before he went solo. I like the film Cinema Paradiso but I will also admit I like Stallone’s Driven! And I don’t like Robert Harris. I love Allpress Espresso but I still drink Starbucks. So move over wankers honesty is the new snobbing! Vented.
//TD
6 comments:
I am anti starbucks and i dont know why? i think it is because the coffee is crap. they always fill it with sweet shit. Here in Toronto we have pumpkin flavored coffee. quite new. is it everywhere or what.
starucks sux. it is costly and fattening. it accounts for a hell of a heap of global trash. i saw one of their big fat cups half blocking an over flowing storm water pipe. if everyone stopped going it would break. so stop.
Our country has a great cafe culture and, by some accounts, produces among the best coffee in the world. So, why should we support Americans coming into our market with their average product served by people on average wages who have average training and often an average grasp of the English language? Furthermore, when Starbucks come into a new market, has anyone noticed how they will open multiple stores in a small geographic area, effecting trade of local operators - some of whom have had family run businesses in the area for many years - then, after they have effectively put the forementioned family operators out of business, they close all their stores leaving one to dominate the newly 'open' market??? In the last couple of years they attempted this strategy in one of our city's trendier streets - they didn't survive... Perhaps it's actually the 'wankers' and 'snobs' who shop in the trendy streets who recognise that by supporting Starbucks they are effectively holding a gun to the head of their own economy, which survives on the efforts of local business selling local product, employing local suppliers, and hiring local people. It's too often the same people bitching and moaning about the state of our economy, whilst in line at Starbucks, waiting for their coffee flavoured milk. Wake up! Stop spending $3.30 for a flat-white, when you can buy a locally roasted, locally brewed similarly proportioned coffee, served by well paid and well trained local baristas, for $3 at the cafe next door! And lets face it, all coffee tastes good once enough sugar or artificial flavouring has been added, which brings me to my next point... should we support an organisation which has fundamentally lowered the average coffee-drinking age by simply adding sweet flavours and fancy names to what is otherwise a stimulant with addictive properties? Makes sense Starbuck would do this, as we only have to look at how successful McDonalds has been in selling playgrounds, to know that marketing to children and teens pays dividends. So some of us choose not to sell our soul to the devil, not to support those who peddle their wares to thems who are too young to differentiate 'good' from 'bad', those who take our money and send it offshore to fat Americans so they can continue to invest into huge marketing campaigns and continue to pull the wool over our poor naive unsuspecting eyes.
You can't compare a Bentley to a Renault and complain that the Renault isn't as good!! of course it's not but the renault is better than say a Hyundai is it not? And in the global car market you would probably say that Hyundai is your average vehicle?
Starbucks never claims to be a Bentley, it knows it's place and price. It is however better than an office filter coffee, and instant Nestle with equally as much sweet crap, it is better than a Robert Harris, Gloria Jeans or even the Koffee Club... and a whole bunch more 'average' brands, hence 'better than your average'.
Those snobs and wankers that claim to be anti Starbucks aren't keeping anything a float other then high priced coffee. And to liken Starbucks to McDonalds verges on outright stupidity! Have you ever seen a Starbucks TV Advertisement? globally? Have you ever seen starbucks advertise in print? In fact it is the other snobby 'family owned' brands that advertise to align themselves with wankers in snobby publications. Is it not them who are in fact doing what McDonalds do just not to kids? Brainwash the rich wankers into believing there is a difference?
The truth is that globally Starbucks have a strategy that EXCLUDES marketing. They have grown into a dominant global position by simply being good! Those that are anti are clearly anti the mainstream and in my opinion have not given the product a fair chance.
Obviously not everyone HAS to like it, but at least have a fair opinion as to why you don't. Many Starbucks stores worldwide are franschised as well which means, wait for it... they too are owned by families. Are you going to judge them and wish these families out of business just because of the brand they choose to plaster on the premises?
I also think that Starbucks does not hit retail coffee areas just to put others out of business I think they hit retail coffee areas because that is what they are selling? Does anyone blame a car manufacturer when they open a car yard on the same strip as all the independent car yards? I think they just target where the customer base is? And ask yourself... If Starbacks is as bad as you think and as expensive as you think why is it putting the other cafes supposedly out of business? How shit must they have been? They can't blame the new player, they need to play the game better! go with the market?
And what coffee culture? our coffee culture is only a decade old really, centres like Melbourne and New York have had coffee cultures for decades. Strabucks globalised it sure, but they also waken ours. Many cafe owners might in fact thank Starbucks for revitalising the industry?
Funny thing is that I actually think it is the snobby wanker brands that are pulling the wool over our eyes more than Starbucks. Starbucks is what it is and never claims to be anything different yet almost every independent coffee brand has sold out to the big corporates (primarily supermarket owned) in the last five years. They still run and advertise the brands as independent and wholesome while they are all about the stakeholders dividends? what's worse? These family business are taking the money and running! 90% of the time to Australia!!! And I never see Starbucks full of people moaning about the economy? I see more of that at all the snobby wanker cafes where the topic of conversation used to be property!
Lets face it Starbucks is not great but it is by no means bad. The point to the venting was simply why be a hater? what is the point? I mean to hate something you have to have good reason? Anonymous... they're pretty thin?
TD
You make some good arguments TD obviously based on some sound reason and logic - I'm just not sure how informed your arguments are...
Inaccuracies:
1."I also think that Starbucks does not hit retail coffee areas just to put others out of business"
An exert from 'No Logo' by Niaomi Klein:
"the mechanics of Starbucks' dizzying expansion during the past thirteen years has more in common with Wal-Mart's plan for global domination than the brand managers at the folksy coffee chain like to admit. Rather than dropping an enormous big box on the edge of town, Starbucks' policy is to drop "clusters" of outlets in urban areas already dotted with cafes and espresso bars. This strategy relies just as heavily on an economy of scale as Wal-Mart's does and the effect on competition is much the same. Since Starbucks is explicit about its desire to enter markets only where it can "become the leading retailer and brand of coffee," the company has concentrated its store-a-day growth in relatively few areas. Instead of opening a few stores in every city in the world, or even in North America, Starbucks waits until it can blitz an entire area and spread, to quote Globe and Mail columnist John Barber, "like head lice through a kindergarten." It's a highly aggressive strategy, and it involves something the company calls "cannibalization."
The idea is to saturate an area with stores until the coffee competition is so fierce that sales drop even in individual Starbucks outlets." ... "There have been other, more brazen ways in which Starbucks has used its size and deep pockets to its competitive advantage. Until the practice began creating controversy a few years back, Starbucks' real-estate strategy was to stake out a popular independent café in a well-trafficked, funky location and simply poach the lease from under it."
2. "Starbucks have a strategy that EXCLUDES marketing"
How many Hollywood movies have key scenes prominently featuring the SB brand in the form of a cup, cafe or signage?... SB has a covert marketing strategy which operates largely below the radar. The average punter doesn't always spot product placement, or realise the serious $$ needed to execute it effectively; Meanwhile we the punters unconsciously associate the SB brand with our favourite actor/movie/experiences.
3. "You can't compare a Bentley to a Renault and complain that the Renault isn't as good!!"
SB (smallest size) Flatwhite: $3.30
Allpress Flatwhite: $3.00
Which is the Bentley and which is the Renault? - I'm confused...
Not misinformed... simply not brainwashed by books written about completely different cultures!!
1 = American book applied to NZ culture? We don't even have Wal-Mart! Name one area where that it has 'blitzed' It hasn't because NZ is a different game with little population!! Blitz suggests becoming a dominant force by numbers over all competitors? Nowhere in NZ has this happened.
I hope you are sure about your facts? In the US what are the competitors they are putting out of business and blitzing??? other chains perhaps? the independant is applied to the poaching of leases and if a successful independant cafe has not got their lease in order and there is the ability to "poach" it out from under them, what kind of business are they running? And if this happens simply because Starbucks have more money, do you honestly think people WILL keep going there based on location alone? If so then it can't be about how good the independents coffee is can it?
This whole american arguement is not even worth justifying because there are a million reasons why this is inaccurate for NZ. Secondly you need to research how many critics have bashed NO LOGO for opinions and misleading facts that are lacking any true basis. Almost every review on this book highlights numerous obvious flaws! So just because you read the book it don't make it true! but then I guess the same could go for many reviews by many specialists... thanks for the quote though, I'm sure it took a while to source and cut n paste.
2 - GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!
Cost of product placement?!! here is a kicker for you! Taken from the Seattle Business Journal March 14 2003. (Seattle is the home of Starbucks if you didn't know) Starbucks does not pay for product placement. Starbucks gets asked more than 25 times per month to be used in a placement. The Starbucks product Placement specialist Chris Gorley has the primary task of brand protection and making sure it is represented in good light. "While many companies would simply hire an outside marketing agency to handle product placements, Starbucks culture is to handle it in-house."
Furthermore just to really piss you off... "But she's not one to micromanage, Gorley says, "We don't require the logo on the cup be displayed in a certain way."
Due to their success this costs them nothing and breeds more success. In some cases they have been paid to be used!
So back to my original question.... what advertising have you seen... oh I forget... every other brand but Starbucks right!
3 - Your confused why? The price tag... oh i forget it's all abut the money... see here I was thinking we were talking about coffee. If the money is what you don't like then that's a very valid reason but the whole point to my arguement it that geezers like you think this but then try to blame it on the coffee!
Interestinly though, for the size and millage you would still need two Allpress coffees to equate to the small Starbucks coffee so actually, it's not that expensive? Sure it would be milkier but you do get a lot more for that extortive $0.30. LEts also note thatfor the millage their smallest size in their most expensive. Starbucks Large is over twice the size but not twice the price. And yes i know they are big and you don't equate that to quality which is why they are in different markets and why Starbucks is not putting Allpress out of business! I like Allpress to, please note i am not saying this is inferior... it is great. When i feel like really good gourmet coffee I drink it. But i also like Starbucks (where obviously you do not) and when I want more quantity, more pop culture sweetness I will drink that. Like i originally pointed out, I like what i like when i like it. I like grunge rock but i am not afraid to admit when i like JT song. I like arthouse film but i am not afraid to admit when I like a Mihael bay blockbuster and i like gourmet coffee but unlike those pretentious snobs i am not afraid to admit when I like Starbucks! And that is my point!
// TD
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